How Much Zone 2 Is Too Much Or No Longer Productive? (#220)

OVERVIEW
Overview: Zone 2 training is all the rage, but there's a point at which more Zone 2 or exclusively training at low intensity is no longer productive. Time-Crunched Cyclists reach this point sooner than time-rich athletes because you don't have the training volume to continue creating a training stimulus. Coach Adam Pulford shares his solutions for developing aerobic fitness using a mixed-intensity training method for Time-Crunched Cyclists.

TOPICS COVERED

• When is it appropriate to do mostly Zone 2 training?
• Why NOT to do just Zone 2 training
• Progression at Zone 2
• Aerobic decoupling
• How to increase Zone 2 power output
• Indoor vs outdoor for Zone 2 rides

ASK A QUESTION FOR A FUTURE PODCAST

HOST
Adam Pulford has been a CTS Coach for nearly two decades and holds a B.S. in Exercise Physiology. He's participated in and coached hundreds of athletes for endurance events all around the world.

Listen to the episode on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Stitcher, Google Podcasts, or on your favorite podcast platform

GET FREE TRAINING CONTENT

Join our weekly newsletter

CONNECT WITH CTS

Website: trainright.com
Instagram: @cts_trainright
Twitter: @trainright
Facebook: @CTSAthlete

Chapters

• 0:07 Zone 2 Training for Cycling Performance
• 14:34 Balancing Zone 2 Training and Intensity
• 22:41 Interactive Support for Athletes

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:07

From the team at CTS. This is the Time Crunch Cyclist podcast, our show dedicated to answering your training questions and providing actionable advice to help you improve your performance even if you're strapped for time. I'm your host, coach Adam Pulford, and I'm one of the over 50 professional coaches who make up the team at CTS. In each episode, I draw on our team's collective knowledge, other coaches and experts in the field to provide you with the practical ways to get the most out of your training and ultimately become the best cyclist that you can be. Now on to our show. Now onto our show. Welcome back, time Crunch fans. I'm your host, coach Adam Pulford. Zone 2, lsd metabolic testing.

Speaker 1: 0:55

We've got quite the list of topics for you today, all these topics coming from you, our listeners, by the way, and if you're new to the show, welcome. You've found the podcast focused on all things endurance, training and performance wrapped up into a quick, actionable episode. You can write in with any questions that you'd like on these topics at trainrightcom backslash podcast. And that's where our question comes from today. So let's get right down to it. It's a bit of a longer question, but it provides really good context. So let me read the whole thing and we'll start chipping away at the answers.

Speaker 1: 1:31

All right, here is the original question. It's coming from Andy. I'm working on building my base and have submitted to doing nothing much more than LSD Not the drug, by the way, but we'll talk about what that means. I'll mix in some higher intensity at the end of some rides and then even on the 10th ride I'll make that one with some higher intensity, but mostly everything is 90 minutes and LSD Long slow distance or long slow duration is what he's talking about there. By the way, I had a metabolic test done over the summer which determined my zone two heart rate to be around 120 beats per minute. So I ride at that wattage and just stay under it. It turns out that around 150 watts keeps me in a good range for 115 to 120 beats per minute. So how do I progress this? I would ultimately like this zone two power to be closer to 200 Watts or better. And how often should I increase my Watts in zone two rides to work on my zone two power increase, or is that even the correct way to think about it?

Speaker 1: 2:38

Currently I'm on a five to eight week of majority zone two riding. That I do in the trainer in a good steady state week of majority zone two riding. That I do in the trainer in a good steady state. I tried to ride on the road before and I was willing to give up the outdoor ride. I just can't keep a very good steady state aerobic out there. It's very hilly and my power output is so low that on my current zone two that even the slightest incline in the easiest gearing couldn't be or wouldn't be enough to keep my power under zone two requirement.

Speaker 1: 3:10

So thanks, andy. Sorry, really had to push through that. It's a long one, but we got there. So really, what he's talking about is he wants to improve that cruising aerobic power development right A lot of people do. He's in that current zone two base and he wants to have all the knowledge in order to do that.

Speaker 1: 3:31

My initial response to this was actually you know, I'm happy that people are thinking about their training differently and making a plan to proactively make some changes to their physiology Super stoked about it, glad people are hearing the message. But I also get a little worked up when I hear people sacrificing riding outside for indoor riding just to stick to zone two training guidelines, because the message that coaches, athletes and physiologists are pushing can get a little confusing on this topic. So let's dissect all of this and answer your question directly, andy, and we'll also hopefully clear up some of the confusion. So first, andy and folks, when is it appropriate to do mostly zone two training? Well, kind of like three different periods here. And that's when you're building or reestablishing base, which you mentioned here, andy. Okay, so that's when you want to do most of your training in zone two and not really touch the intensity. Okay.

Speaker 1: 4:34

The other time period is when you're trying to improve your fat oxidation or metabolic flexibility. Okay, because you mentioned a metabolic test. You didn't mention the results of that test. However, you mentioned the metabolism. For all of that detail, I'll steer you toward episode number 169 with coach Renee Eastman, entitled sugar burner versus fat burner. That's where we talk about what fat oxidation is. Metabolic flexibility and kind of that aerobic crossover point is metabolic flexibility, and kind of that aerobic crossover point where you are burning more carbohydrate than fat, and so when you're trying to change something metabolically, that's also a good time to keep intensity low.

Speaker 1: 5:13

Stick to zone two, but it's not really what you're asking for, okay, in this question from you, andy. Now another time period is detraining Okay. Now it's coming toward the end of the season for a lot of people and that's when we'll bring intensity down, maybe we just don't even ride for a little while. You know, a week, maybe two, something like that, and you detrain, you bring CTL down intentionally and you get rid of a lot of the built up fatigue, mentally and physically, from big season of riding, okay, and racing and all the other things that go into it. So those three scenarios is where I would bring the intensity down and just do zone two, but for how long and when? And all this kind of stuff. And riding inside is a good way to control the elements to do that. However, be super careful here, folks, because zone two riding only doesn't give you some mystical, magical powers. We're going to talk a lot about that today.

Speaker 1: 6:13

But first let's go to the scenario of when not to do just zone two training. And if you think about that, what I mean here is for time crunch athletes. This is most of the year, don't hear me wrong. Now the majority of your intensity distribution for time crunch athletes, as well as time rich athletes, should be zone two endurance for their year long training program. That means of all the rides that we do all year round, over 50% should be in that zone two. I would argue 70, maybe 80% kind of depending on what the program is that you're doing and whatnot. But the majority of our riding should always be endurance riding, zone two.

Speaker 1: 6:58

But for the time crunched athlete, the yearly volume is too low to spend eight weeks or more focused on zone two only and you'll get a ton more benefit from mixed intensity training throughout the year. Time crunched athletes are not professional athletes doing 20 to 30 hours of training. So don't think that you need to train like a professional athlete for months and months of zone two to build your base. As time crunch athletes, we need something different. It's not that you're doing too much zone two. It's that you're actually not doing enough in order to get the total stress needed to improve your performance and capacity. And when you improve performance and capacity, that's how you'll increase your zone to cruising power, your FTP, your VO2 max and all these other things. So, andy, to your specific scenario at some point, 90 minutes of riding five to six times per week is just not going to build any more fitness or improve your metabolic flexibility any further. You need intensity to move the needle on fitness and performance in your overall physiology.

Speaker 1: 8:12

In fact, when I modeled out a fitness build for an example athlete on training peaks, let's just call her Jane Doe, she's. And if she's new at starting out, let's just assume zero CTL, which is never actually true. But in the case of this, this is a model. So let's just assume zero CTL, which is never actually true. But in the case of this, this is a model, so let's run with it. What I did was I built out 90 minutes of writing five days per week, with two rest days in that week as well. At first she'll build CTL nicely at three to five TSS per week for the first seven weeks or so. We call that her ramp rate. After that her ramp rate will slow down to one or two TSS per week. At weeks 11 and 12, the ramp rate's only one, and at week 16, the CTL plateaus around 43 or 44 and no longer increases, with seven and a half hours of training at zone two per week. And so by using CTL as a model in this example, I would make the argument that if your fitness score on training peaks is around 40, okay, plus or minus five to 10, something like that.

Speaker 1: 9:20

Doing seven and a half hours of zone two training is not going to build the base of your aerobic fitness any further, and it can actually decrease fitness as it pertains to CTL. For example. If you were if you're coming into this block Andy and you had a CTL of 70 and used his eight weeks of zone two riding seven and a half hours, so 90 minutes of riding five days a week this that your CTL will go down. Okay. Now there's reasons that you would want to do that, especially like metabolically. Maybe you just want to get away from intensity, maybe it is your off season. I would say that there's better ways of structuring that eight weeks. Okay.

Speaker 1: 10:00

Really, what I'm trying to press in here is there's nothing magical about zone two training by itself. There's a lot of other things to consider when you're doing it. And don't think that reducing training load will make you more fit. It will not. If you want to increase your base, you need to put in more hours of total training or lengthen the duration of a long ride on the weekend or any day that works for you, aiming for like three hours plus and increasing that to deepen the base. You need to do something different in order to make big improvements. Or you can use intensity to increase ramp rates, ctl and aerobic capacity. Now let's talk about progression at zone two. Aerobic capacity Now let's talk about progression at zone two.

Speaker 1: 10:50

You don't have to get much more complicated than what Andy laid out here in the way of doing a block of zone two. Okay, it's basically ride your bike consistently uh, endurance, pace, zone two, training parameters, all that kind of stuff and endurance miles are zone two. Riding day after day is the way you do that. Yeah, you can um throw in a couple of sprints in there and progress the long ride, like we talked about, every 10 days, or maybe even like once a week. That's fine. Andy mentioned every 10 days, that sort of thing. And so there's a lot of ways to build base here. In fact, I did a podcast with Coach Coley Moore from Empirical, empirical cycling. It's called a practical guide to base training and it's episode number 82. Check that one out for a more structured and, I would say, kind of better way or a few creative ideas on how to build base for time crunched athletes.

Speaker 1: 11:41

One thing to touch on here real quick LSD. Long slow duration or long slow distance touch on here real quick LSD, long slow duration or long slow distance this only works if you can do the long portion of that. Anybody can go easy, okay, but you need to go long, and you know what. You won't get the total stress that you think you are if you don't go long enough. All of that pertains to your own individual physiology and all this kind of stuff. If you're new to riding bikes, a two-hour ride is a long ride and that will move the needle. If you've been doing this thing for five to 10 years, a two-hour ride is probably your normal ride. You know time crunch to weekend sort of ride, and so, in that way, don't think that subscribing to LSD training is going to do anything for you. It's not Okay.

Speaker 1: 12:32

One tool that will give a little bit more insight is called aerobic decoupling. Now, this is something that is available for you on training peaks, and I go over how to use this metric and all of its nuances in episode number 195 with CTS coach Renee Eastman, and the title of that is what to do about intensity creep. In simple terms, this is a metric you can use to check in on your aerobic system to see if it's handling aerobic stress appropriately compared to norms that we'd like to see in a cardiovascularly fit person, and making sure that you don't quote decouple more than 5% over the course of a steady ride or longer during aerobic ride or threshold ride. There's a lot of noise to this metric. Okay, because it involves heart rate and normalized power. Okay, and so what it's doing is actually looking at the relationship of your normalized power and your heart rate. So what it's doing is actually looking at the relationship of your normalized power and your heart rate in the first half of the ride compared to the second half and the way I use it for aerobic or threshold. Everything should be steady overall and I would say there's a lot of art that goes on into using it. Well, now I'm not going to get into the details Again.

Speaker 1: 13:47

Listen to that podcast with Renee or I, linked to a great article by Coach Joe Friel, who's been on the podcast several times, on how to use this in your training. Check it out in the show notes. The title of the article is called Are you Fit? All About Aerobic Endurance and Decoupling by Joe Friel. In my opinion, I don't think aerobic decoupling tells a full story, ensuring if you are fit, but it can shed some light on your internal strain and durability during those long, steady efforts. Andy, to you it can give you some insight on how to test your zone two power and see what your heart rate is doing and if you decouple less over time, that means you are improving. That's how I would use it. Anyway, increasing zone two power People are super into this right now.

Speaker 1: 14:34

Two ways I think about it is you can either push it up or pull it up. I say that when you push it up you do lots of volume, so you're putting. The metaphor is you're putting a lot of hay in the barn, so this is doing higher volume. Okay, for time crunched athletes. You typically say time crunched athlete is like six to eight hours per week on average. If you can nudge it up to 10 hours per week, maybe 12 for a short time period, that's putting hay in the barn. You're pushing your aerobic capacity up. Okay, you're putting hay in the barn for later that you want to use. Okay, that's, that's the full analogy there. So that's that's when I say you can push up with lots more volume or you can pull it up, and that's using intensity or, ideally, a mix of volume and intensity, and so the best way to do this is using a training principle called progressive overload with mixed intensities, and if you do this right, you'll increase your fitness, you'll increase your FTP as well as your zone two power.

Speaker 1: 15:33

Now a couple of things here as it relates to Andy's example. Based on your power of 150 Watts, andy, your cruising zone two power, it's about. Of 150 Watts, andy. At your cruising zone two power, it's about, let's just say, that's the middle of zone two. For you, that would put your FTP around 220 Watts. In order to increase your zone two power from one 50 up to 200 Watts, you'd need to increase your FTP by around 55 or 60 Watts. Now that's 25%. That's realistic, but it's aggressive. But it's realistic Now. You can't do this unless you significantly increase total volume or increase intensity throughout the week. Bang for the buck training your glycolytic energy system is the best way to do this, and that's your FTP. We can change FTP by 25% with trained individuals using a solid training program. So for you, andy, I would focus on increasing your FTP in order to increase not only in zone two power but your total performance, your fitness and capacity on the bike.

Speaker 1: 16:33

How I do this in my coaching process is after building base, I build intensity to improve FTP and other performance metrics. I work the aerobic system and the anaerobic side of things throughout the season and I layer those things together and I keep on weaving one up and one down to keep fitness and performance building throughout between seasons or in that transition phase. I do let some of that go during the detraining phase, but I keep it shorter for time crunched athletes, like two to three weeks tops and that's but I I I make sure that the CTL doesn't drop too much, and then what I do is I'd link together those two seasons and keep on layering the fitness and everything else on on top of that. Okay, meanwhile, keep the ball rolling from there and you try to manage all the curve balls that life throws at you. That's a tricky one, but for time crunched athletes I'm not doing eight weeks of zone two only.

Speaker 1: 17:33

Let's talk about riding indoors versus outdoor for zone two rides. Here's where I'm going to get a little worked up. If you like riding outside, ride outside. I would never sacrifice riding outdoors for indoors in order to keep zone two training, unless you're trying to change something metabolically, like I've already mentioned before, or you had some significant time away from the bike and you're starting to rebuild again. Okay, that's another. So you went through transition phase, detraining phase, whatever you want to call it. Now we're just starting to ride again, or if it's just super cold, rainy, mixed sleet and the outdoor riding conditions are not conducive to getting some good training done.

Speaker 1: 18:12

No doubt that indoor riding is great for fitness and predictability and control the elements. If you have a good indoor training setup, it's pretty simple just to hop on and start riding. So I'm all in favor of indoor riding, especially from the simplicity aspect of that. But riding outside has a ton. If you like it right, if you enjoy riding outside, it's got a ton of benefits, including fresh air, vitamin D, engagement with nature, actually learning how to drive and steer and ride your bike. The skill work of cornering, pacing, descending can go away if you don't use it. So I'd encourage many people to keep riding outside and don't stop riding outside just to stick to zone two.

Speaker 1: 18:57

Okay, now I live in hilly terrain in my zone two. Can't stay in it. Okay, let's talk about that. Andy, I get your point in living in a hilly area. In fact I was just. Actually I was riding with CTS coach Jim Lehman in Colorado about four weeks ago now, and we're talking about this because I have an athlete who lives in Park City same scenario, okay. So we were talking about this and Jim's angle was it doesn't matter that much. If you like riding outside, it's fun and you engage with it. Doing more, you don't have to get super structured, but just ride the hills, descend, aim for a flat day once in a while you'll actually carry that capacity more rather than just Basically. What he's saying is the mixture of intensities and the engagement with that is going to be just fine. Okay, cause you're probably up in that zone three little mixture of zone three and that's certainly not going to hurt you. And if you're just riding to build fitness and things like this, that's totally fine.

Speaker 1: 19:58

Now some tips to try out. Uh, on my side of things and what I use for my athletes is, if you have a mountain bike or a gravel bike, ride that on roads on your zone two days, because typically we have we have a shorter gears, so easier gears that you can go into a hill and keep it aerobic for longer. Okay. Now, if you have an e-bike, you could use that on your zone two days. Another one of my athletes, actually, um, who lives in, who lives in Park City. He has an E-mountain bike and he does that on his endurance days because it's just super fun. He's out there and keeps the heart rate low. Build an endurance.

Speaker 1: 20:33

Third thing change out your cassettes. Now, this will cost some money maybe a couple hundred bucks but read up online, see what your bike can take. You swap the cassette and the chain and, as long as your derailleur can handle it, swap those out. You get some easier gears and you keep the heart rate and power low as you're riding outside. So I'm glad. I'm glad people are getting the message here.

Speaker 1: 20:52

On aerobic training, five to 10 years ago I'd be encouraging people to skip the group ride and do some solo endurance work more often. And now it's like whoa, maybe jump in that group ride or maybe hit the intensity more. Like I'm saying here to Andy Okay, but riding your bike should be fun, not something that you're submitting yourself to the zone two gods, being pulverized by all the coaches, podcasters and articles jumping on the most recent bandwagon of training hype. It all comes down to what you're trying to accomplish in your training. I don't have all the background on you, andy, but I would recommend that if you enjoy riding your bike outside and if you haven't taken a ton of time away from training meaning you still have decent CTL riding outside two to three times per week in the hills, hit it however you want and then do your zone two riding inside. That's probably a better combination to keep CTL up there. Keep the fun factor up there, change it up and it'll bring good contrast, variety and mixture of intensities so that you can keep your fitness and not have to submit to the indoor gods. My main message is don't throw away fitness thinking that zone two only will give you more of it, because if it's low volume for eight weeks it won't. You can actually get less fit Now, like I said previously, there could be a time and place for this property training phase, metabolic training, building base from zero on upward. But unless it's those three scenarios, I'd keep fitness and vibes rolling by keeping some intensity in the mix right and outside. Still do some zone two inside, like I mentioned earlier. So in closing, that's it.

Speaker 1: 22:40

That's our show for today.

Speaker 1: 22:41

Thank you all again for tuning in and listening to our show and to our audience members, like Andy, who have written in.

Speaker 1: 22:48

Thank you, it's great to hear from you and learning what you want to learn more of. Okay, and as we whip up some shows specifically on what you want to hear, it's super fun to be able to connect with you in that way. For those of you with that burning question in mind that haven't asked yet, remember that you can head over to trainrightcom backslash podcast, click on ask a training question, fill out the form and submit it in. Those get sent directly to me and I'll do my best to answer it on an upcoming episode. While you're there, you can check out our newsletter or the CTS membership, and if you're curious on how coaching works, you can find more information on how to get started. Our goal is to provide you with every resource possible that you need to improve your performance, your fitness and have a ton of fun on your athletic journey. Remember to come back next week for more actionable training advice on all things endurance related.